Paul's Understanding of "World"

[Barry]

Paul's Understanding of "World"

Here is the link:


http://infinite-grace.com/paulsdefofworld.htm

Now this is not the easiest article to read that I have ever written LOL!
It's not smooth and I may rewrite it at some point in the future. But it is something that I thought would be at least informative (at least I hope so) in how Paul seems to be finding his way around;
1) The world of the old covenant headship
2) The world of the old covenant attachment as applied locally within the sphere of Israel's influence. This being the world that the gospel was preached to.
3) The world of old covenant attachment Universally speaking. Mankind at large.

Any comments are welcome
Barry

[Barry]

Additional points and verses that might be interesting:

Gal 1:4 Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world {Age}, according to the will of God and our Father:
Gal 1:5 To whom glory for ever and ever. Amen.
Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are [B]so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: {See 5:2}

[Gal 5:2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.]

Gal 6:12 As many as desire to make a fair shew in the flesh, they constrain you to be circumcised; only lest they should suffer persecution for the cross of Christ.
Gal 6:13 For neither they themselves who are circumcised keep the law; but desire to have you circumcised, that they may glory in your flesh.
Gal 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

When we combine the thoughts expressed in Galatians concerning the "world" that then was as he speaks also of the "elements of the world" along with Paul's thoughts to the Corinthians, we get a grasp of how Paul can both move between and (or) intermingle "covenantal rule" and "covenantal attachment".

Covenantal rule was the world of covenant headship. Covenantal attachment was that which the headship addressed on a larger scale. Covenantal attachment should be seen as Universal in scope, but locally applied, within the sphere of Israel's influence. [This is possible, because such was concerned with a "revelation" on a historical level. Revelation on a historical level address an evolving consciousness.]

What we are faced with (scripturally) however is that when the "rule" was dealt with, the larger scale of things went with it, covenantally.

Like this:
Luk 12:46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for [him], and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.
Luk 12:47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not [himself], neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many [stripes].
Luk 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few [stripes]. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
Luk 12:49 I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled?

In principle compared to:

Act 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
Act 17:29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
Act 17:31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by [that] man whom he hath ordained; [whereof] he hath given assurance unto all [men], in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Paul is speaking of a judgment that would be outworked, within the whole of the sphere of Israel's influence wherein Israel would receive the brunt of it as covenantal rule (dwell not in temples made with hands 17:24).

We see this principle of covenantal attachment in 1 Cor. 6:1-8

1Cr 6:1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?
1Cr 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
1Cr 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? [Separate note: "this life" here is to be defined as life then in the present evil age]
1Cr 6:4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.
1Cr 6:5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?
1Cr 6:6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers.
1Cr 6:7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? why do ye not rather [suffer yourselves to] be defrauded?
1Cr 6:8 Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that [your] brethren.

In essence then they were bringing their brother to the "pagan" magistrates that belonged to that age. And so then the judgment that would be done in the ending of that age did judge the covenant rule (angels) and encompass the whole of the covenantal attachment. That age ended for everyone.

Judgement as in the ending of that age, was covenant rule focused but not covenant rule exclusive. It is a micro to macro application.

Just a few thoughts,
Barry

[alicia]

Hi Barry,

I liked the article. I was going along pretty well and then got lost a little because I get overwhelmed by lots of passages, etc (snow-screen effect). It's not your writing style, it's my speed of comprehension when it comes to these things...

I tried to put myself in those times as a "commoner" and try to picture myself listening to this good news. I would have been very happy to hear this. Basically what the message was -- "Don't let the know it alls try to put you down. They don't know any more than you do. We're all in this together, things are about to change :)!" I can also see where this was probably a little intimidating for most and probably met up with a lot of cynicism as well. Not to mention the higher ups frowning on dissention amongst the ranks in society!

That, in my opinion, would have been breath of fresh air if I truly believed it. I'm sure there were optimists at that time too! I would have been the first one to jump in.

That's where I am so far. I will re-read it later and probably get more. I also agree with you that we focus way too much on personal growth and forget the big picture. Even those who don't attend "church" on a regular basis but are on a spirituality kick or personal growth, can get caught up in perfectionistic tendencies to a point of exasperation either by doing too much or doing too little... It's much easier to look at it the way you suggest and lots more fun.

Thanks for helping us keep a finger on the pulse of the story! It should be one we can't get enough of!

Keep up the good work

Alicia

[David Timm]

Now this is not the easiest article to read that I have ever written LOL!
It's not smooth and I may rewrite it at some point in the future. But it is something that I thought would be at least informative (at least I hope so) in how Paul seems to be finding his way around;
1) The world of the old covenant headship
2) The world of the old covenant attachment as applied locally within the sphere of Israel's influence. This being the world that the gospel was preached to.
3) The world of old covenant attachment Universally speaking. Mankind at large.

Any comments are welcome
Barry

Excellent information Barry! I've been trying to come to a better understanding of these things lately myself. I did some research on "world" in the OT and NT and it can become quite confusing at times.

For example:
Isaiah 13:11 Thus I will punish the world for its evil And the wicked for their iniquity; I will also put an end to the arrogance of the proud And abase the haughtiness of the ruthless.

"World" in this verse is limited to the judgment of Babylon shortly after they destroyed Jerusalem and Solomon's temple. This makes it easy to understand how world could often have meant only Israel in the NT. "World" is also used, in what I understand you to be referring to as "The world of the old covenant attachment as applied locally within the sphere of Israel's influence", the Roman Empire and slightly outside it's boundaries. Paul may have preached in Spain and, regarding slightly outside, I'm speaking of Bartholomew and Thomas who most likely preached as far east as India (all before 70AD). Quite a few estimates place the population of the Roman Empire during the first century as making up 1/3 of the earth's population which is quite interesting. Matthew 24:14 would be an example of world referring to this. I'm curious how the known world (Roman Empire) relates to the times of the Gentiles (lit. nations) being fulfilled and what that exactly was. Luke ch. 21 I believe says it was when the nations (Romans) destroyed Jerusalem in 70AD. I do have to admit that it does bother me some the use of hyperbole which is occasionally used with all 3 understandings of the word "world" in both the OT and NT. It makes it difficult about when to take certain words literal or not. Verses with "world" related to Adam I believe expand world even further to include all humankind such as Romans 5:12. I know some may reject this and say that the story is only about Israel, and the called of the nations (Gentiles) only refers to the lost northern tribes of Israel. But Barry I believe your statements about the wisdom of the entire Greek culture, along with the world of Romans 5:12 going back to Adam and his offspring (which was way before Abraham and thus Israel was born) refute this line of thinking. If ya'll have talked about this before, I'd appreciate the link. I believe that their is more than enough evidence showing that not only was Adam the first covenant man, but he was also the first physical man (I don't believe this necessitates a young earth). I might comment some more later when I can organize my thoughts.

David

[Barry]

Alicia
Thanks sis! I do very much appreciate your interest. Will have more to say tomorrow Lord willing.

Hey David

I believe your statements about the wisdom of the entire Greek culture, along with the world of Romans 5:12 going back to Adam and his offspring (which was way before Abraham and thus Israel was born) refute this line of thinking.

It is going to be very difficult to get by Paul's treatment of the term "world" in 1 Corinthians. We need to see IMHO that Paul is able to "covenantally" move from the 3 different nuances (mentioned) of "world".
Paul sees it as Israel spesific, application spesific and Universal at large and is able to merge his thoughts together on all 3 in a given context. In addition to this Paul's points concerning the Greeks were often points to be taken Universally about mankind at large.

In short we will learn more from Paul the apostle to the Gentiles, than we will from the other writings concerning this particular matter.

My sweetheart needs the computer tonight but tomorrow will have more time. Will perhaps like latter try to connect this study with that on covenantal verses Universal creation parallel.

Feel free to comment
Blessings Barry

[alicia]

Thanks for your patience, Barry. I am going to start reading The Cross and the Parousia of Christ next week. Hopefully after that I will have a better grasp of everything in my mind and can follow along with you a little better. I think I'm way off on a lot of things...

Have a great weekend :) I'll see you after 700 or so pages of reading!

Alicia

[Barry]

Just started antibiotics for tooth abscess. Not much good right now for anything other than "Hi there" and "I love you".

Hi there!
I love you!

Barry

[Barry]

Thanks for your patience, Barry. I am going to start reading The Cross and the Parousia of Christ next week. Hopefully after that I will have a better grasp of everything in my mind and can follow along with you a little better. I think I'm way off on a lot of things...

Have a great weekend :) I'll see you after 700 or so pages of reading!

Alicia

Hey Sis, you on page 759 yet?
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

A great book that has helped a lot of people including yours truly get a grip on fulfilled eschatology. Not an easy read however. :)
It is in some places IMHO in need of some "follow up" if I may say, even though in its own way it, as a whole, is a "timeless" work.
To be expected after some 22 years.
Many are looking forward to Max's new book on Romans good Lord willing.

Happy reading!
Barry

[Barry]

Hey David

Isa 13:11 And I will punish the world for [their] evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

Mat 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world {within the sphere of Israel's influence as an applied revelation} for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

1Cr 1:19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.
1Cr 1:20 Where the wise? where the scribe? where [is] the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
1Cr 1:21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
1Cr 1:22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
1Cr 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
1Cr 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
1Cr 1:25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men {Universal statement}; and the weakness of God is stronger than men {Universal statement}.
1Cr 1:26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, [are called] {Universal statement of principle concerning all men Universally "mighty", "noble" even outside of where the gospel was being preached}:
1Cr 1:27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
1Cr 1:28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, [yea], and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are {for all time Universally}:
1Cr 1:29 That no flesh should glory in his presence {for all time Universally}.

Isa 29:14 Therefore, behold, I will proceed to do a marvellous work among this people, [even] a marvellous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise [men] shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent [men] shall be hid.
Isa 29:15 Woe unto them that seek deep to hide their counsel from the LORD, and their works are in the dark, and they say, Who seeth us? and who knoweth us?

I would say that it was "limited" as it was then applied, Perhaps the statement itself can be seen as larger in fulfillment. This IMO was the case as Paul used the scriptures to speak in part in reference to the Greek culture, and Human-hood at large [but from the vantage point of covenantal rule as applied to Israel]. [If that makes any sense?] :)

IMO Paul addresses three nuances to "world" in many of his writings. It is not so vivid in the writings of others because the "others" did not deal as directly with the Gentiles.
They are:
The world of covenantal rule, in the holders, the entrusted one, of types and figures.
The world of covenantal attachment that the "revelation" was applied to wherein the sphere of Israel's influence was the directive.
The world Universally which such depicted. Being a historically revelation it embraced universally, and outwardly, a truth of how human-hood was historically moved from "healing from sin" to "evolution" where everything was made new.

God could not share with humankind in the era of a valid "knowledge of good and evil" held within the covenantal rule of types and figures.

ASV
Act 17:22 And Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus, and said, Ye men of Athens, in all things, I perceive that ye are very religious.
Act 17:23 For as I passed along, and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an altar with this inscription, TO AN UNKNOWN GOD. What therefore ye worship [I]in ignorance, this I set forth unto you.
Act 17:24 The God that made the world and all things therein, he, being Lord of heaven and earth [I]{both Universally and covenatally}, dwelleth not in temples made with hands; {because he made it all, both Universally and covenantally, including gold and silver and anything that you or anyone else might choose to try and form a supposed image deity}
Act 17:25 neither is he served by men's hands {neither from covenantal rule nor covenantal attachment as applied in the sphere of Israel's influence, nor Universally}, as though he needed anything, {from anyone, anywhere, at anytime} seeing he himself giveth to all life, and breath, and all things; {both in covenantal rule and Universally}
Act 17:26 and he made of one every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, having determined [their] appointed seasons, and the bounds of their habitation; {within this sphere of covenantal outworking}
Act 17:27 that they should seek God, if haply they might feel after him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us:
Act 17:28 for in him we live, and move, and have our being {a Universal statement but applied to that covenantal outworking}; as certain even of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring {a Universal statement}.
Act 17:29 Being then the offspring of God {a Universal statement applied to the covenantal outworking} , we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and device of man {Universal statement} .
Act 17:30 The times of ignorance therefore God overlooked; but now he commandeth men that they should all everywhere {within this world of outworking} repent:
Act 17:31 inasmuch as he hath appointed a day in which he will judge the world in righteousness by the man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men {within this sphere of influence} , in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Don't know if this really adds anything useful or not but they are some thoughts on the subject.

Further thoughts:
There is no way to separate the covenant application which had geographical limits from the Universal implication upon humanity. There is no way to have a fulfillment covenantally and then a repeat "judgement" later, outside of the local judgement.

Paul sees the three nuances of "world" as unified in "age".
The wisdom that was destroyed or brought to nothing, was applied, firstly in covenantal rule, secondly in applied influence and thirdly Universally. For it is not just covenantal "man's device" or covenatal "gold and silver" that Paul address. Everything is "made new" cannot be duplicated but can be applied in the realm of the realization of things as they are.
In my view it must be calculated as a historical revelation.

Barry

[alicia]

HI Barry,

I picked up the book this afternoon:) All I can say is WOW this is a whopper of a book! No wonder they call it the "brick" :) I'll start tomorrow. I have an easy week this week at work so will try to make a dent in it...

I truly am hoping this will help me put things together. I don't like to "sort of know " anything. I like to know it by heart. I think this will do the trick.

Hope the tooth is better. Take the FULL COURSE of antibiotics :).

Alicia

[Barry]

I will do that Alicia!
Hope that the antibiotics will take care of the problem. If not futher work will have to be done.

BTW, if you have to re-read a lot that is "normal" LOL.

Barry

[David Timm]

Barry, I appreciate the dialog and insights. I'll have to reread the last few posts and look into this more. I'm also curious if the 4 different usages of kosmos (2889) may make these different audiences of "world" clearer.

The usages include: kosmon, kosmos, kosmou, and kosmo (has a tilde over the second "o")

I'll let you know if I learn anything interesting. I hope the tooth situation doesn't get serious.

David

[Barry]

Eph 2:1 And you [did he make alive,] when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins,
Eph 2:2 wherein ye once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the powers of the air, of the spirit that now worketh in the sons of disobedience;
Eph 2:3 among whom we also all once lived in the lust of our flesh, doing the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature {old covenant nature, not biological nature} children of wrath, even as the rest:--
Eph 2:4 but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
Eph 2:5 even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved),
Eph 2:6 and raised us up with him, and made us to sit with him in the heavenly [places], in Christ Jesus:
Eph 2:7 that in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus:

Here is a given future agenda. They are very rare actually.
God planed on using this in the future to show the grace that He had bestowed upon the firstfruits in that time. (See 3:21)

Eph 2:8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God;
Eph 2:9 not of works, that no man should glory.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.
Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that once ye, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called Circumcision, in the flesh, made by hands;
Eph 2:12 that ye were at that time separate from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

Again, world is used both in connection with covenant rule and covenant attachment that held visible within the sphere of Israel's influence.


Rom 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law [is] the knowledge of sin.

Phl 2:14 Do all things without murmurings and disputings:
Phl 2:15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;

Barry