teaching our children

[christyG]

I would like to know, what do you teach your children? Do you teach them your fulfilled views? Do you let them come to their own conclusions? Or both?:)

[Paige]

Christy,

I think I am a teacher by nature, and I tend to spill out everything I believe. I do honestly share with my kids my own struggles and how I saw things before, plus why I've changed my mind about things. So, I'm pretty open with them and I try to make sure they know that if they have questions or are troubled with something, that they can always talk about it with me. I may not have the answers, but I'll sure help look for them :)

Paige

[Amie]

Christy,

I do teach them the fulfilled view, but above it all I hope to instill the ideas of freedom and God's love in them. No one has to have every "I" dotted and every "T" crossed theologically to recognize love and liberty.

Do you have children? How have you been dealing with it?

Amie

[christyG]

I have three children 8, 6 and 4 3/4 :). Because they are getting older, I have found that I am just coming into this. Of coarse, basic life skills are addressed since birth, love your neighbor, respect yourself and others, take care of what God has given us, etc... But because we do still attend church, I can see that they are slowly being indoctrinated.:( So I thought that I would start teaching them from home, some family Bible study time. I find it hard to address basic Bible stories, Moses, or Noah for example without getting into issues that I'm afraid they are not old enough to understand. There is so much depth in the word that I find it hard to put it into children's terms. And I am a trained teacher! Maybe I'm over thinking it.

I see the fulfilled view as a growth process that occurs over time and in a different way for everyone probably. So I struggle some deciding where to start. How to lay the foundation without indoctrinating.

Christy

[Bill]

Hey Christy,

I think that if you teach them (and model for them) that God loves them as they are then that will set the stage for them to understand the fulfilled viewpoint. For me the main teaching of the fulfilled view is that all conditions have been fulfilled and we don't have to fear God's judgment so we can rest in God's love.

You can read more about this principle in action here

http://billsbloggins.blogspot.com/2006/02/two-gospels-of-narnia.html

Bill

[Amie]

Christy,

I think your concern is very valid and is an obstacle for a lot of parents (endoctrinization of our children). We don't attend church. I don't know of a church in my area that allows for freedom of opinion and is Christ centered (we have "Unitarian Universalist" churches that allow for freedom, but seem to have little reverence for Christ). I find that they push the Preacher's/Pastor's/Priest's/denomination's opinion as if it were "fact" and "truth".

I'm tempted sometimes, to get a church going myself.

Amie

[Infinite Grace]

http://www.ucc.org/find/city_ucc.php

http://www.elca.org/ScriptLib/OS/Congregations/cdsSearch.asp?state=TX&city=San+Antonio&I3.x=79&I3.y=6

https://www.ddi.org/scripts/cgiip.exe/WService=ybv2/yb01.htm

Amie,
These are the websites for the congregation finders of the United Church of Christ, the Evangelical Lutheran, and Disciples of Christ denominations. These are typically Christ-centered denominations - that is not to say they don't have their problems. But as you can see, you have several to pick from. In the UCC, each congregation is unique in its approach to life. Some UCCs are what are called Open and Affirming (ONA). This means that they accept gays and lesbians without reservation regarding the faith (they don't believe that gays and lesbians need to "repent"). There are a number of church who have embraced Faithful and Welcoming (FAW) status, which means that they want homosexuals to come, they are welcome with all others. But they will preach that homosexuality is a "sin" and needs to be repented of. Then there are congregations like mine who are "middle of the road." I have never heard one sermon by my pastor against homosexuality. He always preaches a positive, Christ-centered message of hope. He never bad-mouths other religions.

Church can be what we make of it. When I hear something that I don't agree with, I talk to my kids about it. I don't allow my kids to go to Sunday School or any other "training" program of the church. I control what they learn, even down to homeschooling for their educational needs. That's my job. It does make me laugh at your inconsistency, my lovely sister. You won't take your kids to church for "indoctrination" but you'll put them in public school where they are bombarded with a Christ-denying message daily. Oh well, that's another story...sorry.

There are other groups that you can fellowship with. Dean Johnson of Quakin' Friends (a friend of our ministries) has a link on How to start a Quaker fellowship. They may not be as Christ-centered as you would like, but then again, if you start it, you can make it as C-c as you want. Also, there are already Quaker meetings in your area. Here's a link for those:

http://www.quakerfinder.org/QF/qfind.php

Anyway, those are suggestions. If anyone else is looking for something in their area, you can use the same links, but type in your zip code. Amie, I know you don't live in San Antonio proper, but I didn't know your zip. You too can get more specific by typing in a zip code and telling them how far you would travel (radius).

hope this helps

[Amie]

Ed,

Thanks for the info. I'll consider it :).


It does make me laugh at your inconsistency, my lovely sister. You won't take your kids to church for "indoctrination" but you'll put them in public school where they are bombarded with a Christ-denying message daily. Oh well, that's another story...sorry.

I don't see the public schools as a threat. I haven't noted any "Christ-denying messages". I love you for expressing your thought, I will try to be open :).

I am beginning to see hope for church, though along with that I am noticing my own baggage about going (trust issues). I'm not sure how I'm going to approach that yet, but awareness is a big step.

Amie

[christyG]

Hey thanks guys!

And Ed,

Church can be what we make of it. When I hear something that I don't agree with, I talk to my kids about it. I don't allow my kids to go to Sunday School or any other "training" program of the church. I control what they learn, even down to homeschooling for their educational needs.

Thanks Ed, I think that is the way that I am going to have to go. I happen to teach our Elementary Sunday School Class, so I can control what is learned in there!;) I also do try to talk with my children about what they are discussing at church. If you don't mind Ed, what "kind" of church do you attend? Mine is non-denominational, and fairly open, but of coarse everyone comes with their own set of baggage, and some hold on to it longer than others.

Christy

[Infinite Grace]

I go to a United Church of Christ. Their statement of faith is to my liking and most of their theological positions are acceptable to me (and they make room for the infinite grace position). I am bothered by their extreme liberalism politically, but my congregation has a pastor that is quite moderate. He is very open to a lot theologically, his eldest son teaches Morals and Ethics at a Universalist Seminary in Chicago.

[Paige]

Ed, I've never heard of a United Church of Christ. Does it have any affiliation w/ Church of Christ, or is it just similarly named?

Paige

[Infinite Grace]

Not really. You can go to this link www.ucc.org and click on the About us tab.

The main reason that I go there is the vagueness in their statement of faith. lol. Sounds bad, eh?

[Paige]

Thanks Ed,

I was able to find one in the Spokane Valley. The map says it is about 12 miles away from me. I may just go and check them out!

Paige

[backtothefuture]

Mostly we have not had to undo to much damage with the kids from what they learned in church. WHO are 25 and 23. They missed out on Sunday school due to a lot of sickness, its me who has warped their minds and had to change. Through that, I have been able to express more what I am thinking now. More along the lines the God loves them for just who they are. Part of my conflict in my healing was teaching them the truth and not being able to accept it myself. But that is changing now. The more I walk in grace I have noticed the calmer my family is becoming. Even though we have our hard times.
My son has always been a thorn in my flesh when it comes to church and religion. He bought a tee-shirt 3 years ago with Jesus on the cross and it said, Jesus did it for the chicks. 5 years ago I would have had a breakdown. But I just let it be and he hasn't worn the shirt in 2 years. He will say things like, oh mom, you are going to go to hell because of something I said or didn't say. Now I tell him, there is no hell!! And I don't believe that anymore. He hasn't harassed me for a long long time. In fact, last Sunday when we had the blow out here and I told him I didn't believe in God anymore, he just stood at the end of my bed and said, "now mom, you are just having an emotional day" I was stunned. He didn't throw any digs at me or anything.
We also attended church last night. My husband is having such a hard time with his job. So I kind of gritted my teeth and really softly all garbled said "do you want to go to church?" and he said yes! Anyway they had a concert by Matt Redmond who sings and has written just about every worship song that I love. So I was so blessed. And I know in my heart that my husband needs to be there. Heck, I probably need to be there. The message was good, the music heart blessing. The theology, not the best, but I decided to get past that and try to take what ever I could use to make my life a better one.
Part of me is afraid to trust and go back into the church. So much of my pain has come from that part of my life. And yet, as God teaches me grace, I can see that it is also a place of broken people and we all are in this life together.
Have a nice day
Nancy

[christyG]

Nancy,

Thank you for your reply. You are so open and honest, I find you to be an inspiration.


The message was good, the music heart blessing. The theology, not the best, but I decided to get past that and try to take what ever I could use to make my life a better one.


That is what I try to do as well. I have found that there is a little good in everything.

Taking Ed's advice, I will however, begin to guide my children in their growth. I hope to instill a love and passion for the word that I have in them. In the past my passion for study and learning have taken me away from them. Now, I am trying to incorporate them into that process a little more. Our Wednesday evening family Bible study time was wonderful!

Christy

[christyG]

Side note... I found an old children's book called "When God Imagined a World", by Jean H. Richards. It deals with creation, but does not present it in a 7-- 24 hour day typical way of presenting the story of creation. In fact it seems to present a view similar to what Amie has presented on another thread. Ex:
"And God thought, 'Let there be life on the land and in the sea." So something small began to grow. God looked at the small growing thing. He thought of green -- stem -- leaf -- bush -- tree."

It is beautifully written. I checked Amazon and it seems to be out of print now, but used copies are available inexpensively.

The back cover also mentions a children's book called, "Why Do People Pray?" also by Richards. The note about the book says that it teaches that prayer brings a child closer to other people and closer to God. I liked that. This book is not as readily available at Amazon and a little more pricey.

Christy

[Paige]

Christy,

Do those two books have a target age level? My youngest is 11 1/2, so I was wondering if she would already be too old for them?

Thanks,
Paige

[christyG]

They would probably be classified as picture books. But the poetry of the book is certainly appropriate for any age. IMO